Saddam to be Executed on Saturday

[urrzzzzzzzzzz]

My view on the death penalty is that it won't bring a loved one back to life, and I personally wouldn't feel any better if another man died as a consequence.

[Main Admin Account]

pastie said:

No matter what you hear on the tele and radio. Many Iraqis no longer live in fear.This is the start of a new Iraq. We hear what the media and Government want us to hear.The Media network should be taken out of Iraq so that our men and women of the Armed forces can do their job properly without the media blowing things out of proportion (no surprise there)

Can't accept this one Ben. DO you think that the daily carnage of civilians in Baghdad or the hundreds of coffins of US Marines returning to the States is what they want us to hear? Taking away the news (however edited, abridged or 'filtered' it may or may not be) is no way to encourage democracy. What troops do behind closed doors probably goes on anyway, but we shoudl demand that our media relays us information in order that we may form decisions for ourselves, and no militia, terrorist or invading force should be allowed to run amok without the ability of people to pass judgement.

If the media were not over there more of our troops would be alive and thats a Fact.You look at the news and its all one sided.Propaganda in subtle ways.The war isnt going well so now when one of our troops are killed its a and finally... bit.If we were winning it (whatever winning it would mean in a non warzone) would be plastered all over the news. They tell us what they want us to know.If everyone knew the facts (which we should it being democracy and all) peoples opinions on the Iraq conflict would change and Blair and Bush wouldnt be the assholes they are made out to be. Why should everyone pass judgement on things.We are there whatever people say instead of moaning and groaning about it they should be backing the troops who risk their lives to help others..(And this is someone that thinks now Saddams dead they should pull out) Its not going to happen so back the men and women out there.No matter what anyone says.

[Remember Jesus]

Good post Janner.

But let's get one thing straight. Its not a 'war'

[Main Admin Account]

I went more widespread onto the 'War on Terror'

[PASTIE]

I wasn't around to pick up this thread, and it will have gone stale by now.

We can agree to disagree, Ben, and I'll still try to get paper in your hood at football (if you wore one in the rain, you daft shivering sod). Whilst I might agree with you on the shortcomings of Tony Capaldi's right foot, I think we are diametrically opposed on this one. But, because i can't help myself...

The naming of the "conflict" as a war seems neither here nor there; the naming of the "war on terror" is a bizarre media firendly soundbite that defies logic - having a feud with an emotion or a concept is sufficiently meaningless as to encompass all manner of disparate actions under its banner.

The link between the media and the deaths I can understand - a murdered troop generates precisely the sort of publicity the gangsters and fanatacists crave in Iraq - unfortunately the huge majority of Iraqis will be none of these and the world needs to be aware of their plight.

Regarding pulling out, I agree that the US/UK position is untenable - it has been since before the very start. I don't see that the execution of Saddam is particularly significant in creating any change there.

As for passing judgement, I believe that I have every right. I am too ctnical to see that this was an invasion purely to help others, far too much corporate interest has been served. I pay the taxes that contribute to the conflict, I campaigned as hard as I possibly could against it happening and I am a citizen in a country which participated in an illegal and immoral action scorned by the majority of people here and abroad. I have friends, past students and the family members of the people that I work with now in Iraq and in no way do I wish for anything other than their safe return and I feel that the fact that they are out there in the position they are in as utterly unforgiveable. I think we have to accept that our oresence there should be ended not because of anything victorious, but because we can only make the situation worse. I only hope that an effective peacekeeping force might replace us from the UN and have a better chance of clearing up the mess we have left.

But hey, we all have our perspectives. I was a life-long Labour supporter but haven't managed to vote for them since. The sooner New Labour is a thing of the past the better...

Enough

[Pete the Wolf]

I'm ressurecting this thread after the following artictle:

The Iraqi High Tribunal has dropped all charges against Saddam Hussein, who was hanged on 30 December, as the genocide trial of six co-defendants resumed.
They are charged with crimes against humanity over a campaign against Kurds in the 1980s that left 100,000 dead.

Saddam Hussein was hanged after an earlier trial over the killing of 148 Shia Muslims in the town of Dujail.

Many Kurds were disappointed that he was executed before facing justice for his role in the Anfal campaign.

Among the six remaining defendants is Saddam Hussein's cousin, Ali Hassan al-Majid, sometimes known as "Chemical Ali" for his alleged use of chemical weapons against the Kurds.

As the trial resumed he tried to read a prayer from the Koran in memory of his cousin, but the judge ordered him to stop.

The prosecution then played a video, allegedly containing the voice of Mr Majid threatening to bomb the Kurds.

"I will attack them with chemical weapons," the voice said.

The tape also showed pictures of dead men, women and children.

The defence argues the campaign - codenamed al-Anfal, or "the spoils of war" - was a legitimate operation to quell a rebellion after some Kurds sided with the enemy during the Iran-Iraq war.

Executions 'this week'

The trial had been in recess since 21 December.

Its resumption throws the spotlight back on the Iraqi judicial system which has come under international criticism for the handling of Saddam Hussein's execution.

The former leader was taunted at the gallows and illicit images of his execution later appeared on the internet.

The UN has called for a stay of execution for two others sentenced to death in the Dujail trial.

But the Iraqi government says the execution of Barzan al-Tikriti and Awad al-Bandar will take place this week.

A lawyer for the two defendants said that they had told they were going to be hanged along with Saddam Hussein on 30 December.

The lawyer, Issam Ghazawi, said this was "torture" and that waiting for death was "more difficult that death itself".

Correspondents say the Iraqi government, dismissed by growing numbers of Iraqis as weak and ineffectual, is keen to push these executions through in order to prove its strength.

Keen to assert his independence, a spokesman for Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri Maliki on Monday said any political objectives announced this week by the White House will have come from Baghdad, not Washington.

President George Bush is to due to set "benchmarks" for political reform following widespread calls in Washington for a strict timetable of political progress to be imposed on their Iraqi partners.


Right, what the hell's going on here? I voiced my opinions early on in this thread, but this story's thrown a wrench into the works. After a trial which was pretty much airtight against him, fair or not, but then to hang him (something I'm vehemently opposed to) and then drop all charges against him? Does that mean that he's now been declared innocent of all crimes or still guilty of the one he was executed for?

If so, that only strengthens my stand against capital punishment after seeing him being pardoned. It's a bit late for him to be delared an innocent man now, it ain't gonna do him a lot of good.

And one final thing. If he was indeed innocent, why did the judge order his cousin to stop reading a memorial to him. Doubtful as I am over Saddam's 'innocence', I still feel that if he was, surely a verse would show some resepct towards someone who may have been now wrongfully executed.

[Neko Bazu]

All that's happened is they've said it's not worth trying him for the other crimes now, because he's dead anyway. Saves money, gives people less to bitch about etc.

Common sense really, in its own way, though I'm sure it'll be seen as a mistake because it doesn't give closure to the victims etc in a few years' time.

[The Lucky C]

it's not he's been found innocent, it's that he's been pardoned, and believed to have served his punishment. which is complete bullshit.

i'm firmly on the anti-death penalty side here, i don't believe it is right under any circumstances and Saddam - vile mass murdering piece of shit that he was - deserved a fair trial in a neutral venue ie the hague. what he faced instead was victors justice in a kangaroo court, tombstone handed out on the way in. and to hang him before he faced the rest of the charges is self-defeating and hypocritical. they say they're doing this so the people of iraq can come to terms with his reign, and now they never will. a cynic may argue that he was silenced before he could embarrass the white house. unfortunately, i am cynical.


now that Saddam's dead, can we bring our troops home? after all, the stated aim of the conflict was to prevent him getting WMD - i think that's unlikely now.