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Post by thales on May 10, 2007 11:37:10 GMT -1
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Post by jh1980 on May 10, 2007 11:50:26 GMT -1
Yep, it's finally happened. I shall be glad not to have to try to defend him anymore! McDonnell is the way ahead... but he won't beat Brown
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Post by Billy on May 10, 2007 11:51:06 GMT -1
I guess he got what he wanted by going out on a pretty goo dnote - what with the recent developments in NI - but I have to say on the whole I'm a little disappointed in the overall achievements of his term in power
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Post by jh1980 on May 10, 2007 11:55:22 GMT -1
Problem was all the good stuff was done in the first term (Minimum Wage etc) and was relatively low profile stuff... Meanwhile the high profile stuff has been generally done in a context of widescale media and public outcry. Lastly of course the benefits accrued from a stable economy have been completely wasted through a baffling attachment to expensive and inefficient PFI / PPP schemes in health and education... Please, someone stop me commenting...
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Post by HURLOCK on May 10, 2007 11:59:55 GMT -1
Yep see ya later bare faced liar, thanks for all the undelivered promises. Think the best one is he would stamp out sleaze and corruption yet what have we got a police investigation.
Time will tell if knobjockey brown will make any difference, I can't see it though as he's one of blairs bitches
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Post by Billy on May 10, 2007 11:59:57 GMT -1
The other thing I got pissed off with was the sleaze and scandal - something welse which Blair promised to stamp out - we were all looking forward to cleaner politics, but alas it never really worked out.
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Post by addicted2venos on May 10, 2007 12:04:55 GMT -1
The other thing I got pissed off with was the sleaze and scandal - something welse which Blair promised to stamp out - we were all looking forward to cleaner politics, but alas it never really worked out. ........ does it ever?? Politicians are all just salesmen in the business of doing/saying things to buy your vote. Nothing really changes, as there are too many people with a vested interest in maintaining thing as they are!!
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Post by Billy on May 10, 2007 12:05:32 GMT -1
well I guess you have to trust people some of the time
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Post by addicted2venos on May 10, 2007 12:06:00 GMT -1
Problem was all the good stuff was done in the first term (Minimum Wage etc) and was relatively low profile stuff... Meanwhile the high profile stuff has been generally done in a context of widescale media and public outcry. Lastly of course the benefits accrued from a stable economy have been completely wasted through a baffling attachment to expensive and inefficient PFI / PPP schemes in health and education... Please, someone stop me commenting... <give Jules a chinese burn> ......... there, that should do it!!
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Post by Fizzy Bread on May 10, 2007 12:06:29 GMT -1
No Prime Minister's perfect though, but on the scale of things, in terms of what he achieved in power is pretty balanced IMO. While he'll be remembered for the on going events in Iraq, those more politically aware will also remember his achievements. Staying relatively unchallenged in power for a good 10yrs after decades of Tory dominance.
Some of his decisions may be questionable but overall, I reckon he had a very successful 3 terms.
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Post by Travis on May 10, 2007 12:08:18 GMT -1
Oh, the PM's standing down! Phew!! I though Lionel Blair had croaked it.
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Post by addicted2venos on May 10, 2007 12:09:17 GMT -1
well I guess you have to trust people some of the time As I've said before Billy. The word 'politics', translates directly from the greek; poly - many or multiple and tics - blood sucking parasites ....... simple really!!
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Post by jh1980 on May 10, 2007 12:15:27 GMT -1
Politicians are all just salesmen in the business of doing/saying things to buy your vote. Nothing really changes, as there are too many people with a vested interest in maintaining thing as they are!! It infuriates me when people say this! They AREN'T all like that, and if you want to get rid of the ones who are, then campaign and vote them out! Lazy thinking and sad to see it from people I respect! *nurse! more vallium!*
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Post by spurrsgirl on May 10, 2007 12:17:06 GMT -1
Oh, the PM's standing down! Phew!! I though Lionel Blair had croaked it. We couldn't be that lucky Trav
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Post by HURLOCK on May 10, 2007 12:24:20 GMT -1
Politicians are all just salesmen in the business of doing/saying things to buy your vote. Nothing really changes, as there are too many people with a vested interest in maintaining thing as they are!! It infuriates me when people say this! They AREN'T all like that, and if you want to get rid of the ones who are, then campaign and vote them out! Lazy thinking and sad to see it from people I respect! *nurse! more vallium!* Must say what A2V has siad to a certain degree is true: 1. Blair got elected on the basis of making a difference, however can you tell me any real difference between his party and the torries. Naturally people change and evolve, but to this degree. It's like me supporting West ham because they're in the prem! The word 'Spin' my man is made for these individuals, and yet I'm sure as in sales they promise the earth - but when they get back to base the end supplier manufacturer tells them 'it can't be done' I'm shocked you can defend the [unt
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Post by jh1980 on May 10, 2007 12:33:37 GMT -1
Blair got elected on the basis of making a difference, however can you tell me any real difference between his party and the torries. Naturally people change and evolve, but not to this degree. It's like me supporting West ham because they're in the prem! The word 'Spin' my man is made for these individuals, and yet I'm sure as in sales they promise the earth - but when they get back to base the end supplier manufacturer tells them 'it can't be done' I'm shocked you can defend the [unt I can, but you probably wouldn't accept it! However in a way that was the secret of the New Labour success - being like the Tories! doesn't please me at all in many ways, but to say they were the same is a fallacy. The desperation of the Labour Party to regain power was such that at a Parliamentary level it acceded to most of what Blair (and his followers) demanded. That's not something that pleases me or many of the current and former party membership... Still doesn't mean it's a totally different "team" though! No, spin is about selling but actual policy and action has been made by these Labour Governments, and some of it has been good - not as much as I'd like, but some. Shouldn't be that much of a shock... I'm fully behind the Labour Party (not in the new sense)... when you hate the board, do you become a Hammer?! QED fella
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Post by Neko Bazu on May 10, 2007 12:34:15 GMT -1
Lastly of course the benefits accrued from a stable economy have been completely wasted through a baffling attachment to expensive and inefficient PFI / PPP schemes in health and education... Ignoring what I think of the bloke personally, the party under his leadership has made a prize cock-up of the economy (though admittedly that's as much Brown's doing as Blair's policies). No matter what numbers they spin, the fact that it's built on £1.4 trillion consumer debt largely tied up in artificially inflated property prices (never mind private company debt) tells you how fragile the economy really is. As for Brown's 'fiscal golden rule'? What a joke that was I still find it hard to believe they managed to take the country's coffers from in the black to debt somewhere in the trillions. Granted, we're not anywhere near as bad as the US ($627 trillion national debt, last I knew), but still... That said, Blair did bring some good policies in (equal rights [human rights act exempted], minimum wage etc), but for the sake of the country we need whoever follows him to make some serious changes on the financial side of things (not just the economy, but the financial black hole that is the NHS, a revamp of benefits etc), because it's becoming apparent that the current system is going to break soon. The trouble is, I can't see anyone in Westminster willing/able to do that, especially since it stands to be political suicide, courtesy of the millions who'll vote according to what Rupert Murdoch says.
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Post by Travis on May 10, 2007 12:36:22 GMT -1
Oh, the PM's standing down! Phew!! I though Lionel Blair had croaked it. We couldn't be that lucky Trav WHAT?!?!?!??! Now just let me tell you!! If WWIII was to break out tomorrow, and the ability to play charades was likely to be a decisive factor in determining the likely victor, I know who I'd want in my trench!!!
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Post by HURLOCK on May 10, 2007 12:39:06 GMT -1
Blair got elected on the basis of making a difference, however can you tell me any real difference between his party and the torries. Naturally people change and evolve, but not to this degree. It's like me supporting West ham because they're in the prem! The word 'Spin' my man is made for these individuals, and yet I'm sure as in sales they promise the earth - but when they get back to base the end supplier manufacturer tells them 'it can't be done' I'm shocked you can defend the [unt I can, but you probably wouldn't accept it! However in a way that was the secret of the New Labour success - being like the Tories! doesn't please me at all in many ways, but to say they were the same is a fallacy. The desperation of the Labour Party to regain power was such that at a Parliamentary level it acceded to most of what Blair (and his followers) demanded. That's not something that pleases me or many of the current and former party membership... Still doesn't mean it's a totally different "team" though! No, spin is about selling but actual policy and action has been made by these Labour Governments, and some of it has been good - not as much as I'd like, but some. Shouldn't be that much of a shock... I'm fully behind the Labour Party (not in the new sense)... when you hate the board, do you become a Hammer?! QED fella Well you're entitled to your opinion! Ever thought of being a politician, you seem to have the spin and probably have a vast array of fruits and kettle flexes in your flat! Prime candidate!
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Post by spurrsgirl on May 10, 2007 12:39:36 GMT -1
We couldn't be that lucky Trav WHAT?!?!?!??! Now just let me tell you!! If WWIII was to break out tomorrow, and the ability to play charades was likely to be a decisive factor in determining the likely victor, I know who I'd want in my trench!!! What about Una Stubbs ?! She'd be utterly crushed if she thought you weren't longing for her instead
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